Author Topic: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00  (Read 22309 times)

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Offline Skookum

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2013, 10:56:34 PM »
I do carry my manual safety CZ's cocked and locked.

There's hope for you yet, Jim.  If you were to paint your safety levers green, I bet they would become your preferred carry guns.
Skookum
Browning Challenger III, .22 Long Rifle, Glossy Blue
CZ 83, 9 Browning Court, Satin Nickel
CZ 75 Compact, 9 Luger, Dual Tone
CZ 82, 9 Makarov, Czechoslovak Peoples' Army Black
CZ 83, 7.65 Browning, Glossy Blue
Beretta 3032 Tomcat, .32 Auto, Inox

Offline Skookum

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #16 on: November 18, 2013, 11:03:21 PM »
You really believe that? That comblock troops carried the 75, then the 75B, cocked and locked on duty?

No ComBloc troops carried CZ 75s.  The Soviets said "Nyet!" to Commies using a NATO cartridge.  The CZ 75 was allowed to be produced as an export gun.

Quote
The 1911 BS is deep here.

I think the CZ 75 is derived more from the Browning Hi Power than from the Colt 1911; e.g.:  "Browning/FN Hi Power and CZ-75: Are They Related?", http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/Browning%20and%20CZ.htm.


« Last Edit: November 18, 2013, 11:12:57 PM by Skookum »
Skookum
Browning Challenger III, .22 Long Rifle, Glossy Blue
CZ 83, 9 Browning Court, Satin Nickel
CZ 75 Compact, 9 Luger, Dual Tone
CZ 82, 9 Makarov, Czechoslovak Peoples' Army Black
CZ 83, 7.65 Browning, Glossy Blue
Beretta 3032 Tomcat, .32 Auto, Inox

Offline mitchg233

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #17 on: November 20, 2013, 01:16:53 PM »
No doubt related. The CZ was improved, because it had DA, avoiding both the stupid condition 3 and the unsafe condition 1.  CZ's are as beautiful as the BHP, and more useful too.

I should not have said troops, should have said cops. Guaranteed they were not authorized to carry cocked and locked. You can tell that by examining their half a cow size holsters.

The para is actually a German/Nazi round, the 9x18 just a little to big to work in those guns, but a para will work in Mak guns, albeit with a pucker factor.

Offline md02geist

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #18 on: November 29, 2013, 08:45:38 PM »
I always wanted to see a comparison like this. I have held both and really prefer the compact or P01 type.

Offline Skookum

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #19 on: November 30, 2013, 10:55:41 AM »
No doubt related. The CZ was improved, because it had DA, avoiding both the stupid condition 3 and the unsafe condition 1.

Read your CZ 75 Instruction Manual ? I believe it says, in so many words, to carry and store in Condition 3.

Why do you label Condition 1 carry as unsafe?

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CZ's are as beautiful as the BHP, and more useful too.

The BHP is the longest produced 9 Luger pistol on the market.  It has survived nearly 80 years and been copied often because it's a great design.  Whatever advantages the CZ 75 has over it can likely be attributed largely to advances in technology in the four decades between 1935 and 1975.  I'd be surprised if the CZ 75 wasn't better in many ways.  What does impress me is that the CZ 75, with better capacity and better out-of-the-box trigger than the BHP is available at half the price of the BHP.

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I should not have said troops, should have said cops. Guaranteed they were not authorized to carry cocked and locked. You can tell that by examining their half a cow size holsters.

The CZ 75 was originally an export pistol.  I seem to recall that one wasn't sold domestically until 1985.  Thus, commie cops didn't carry it either.

How does a large holster preclude Condition 1 carry?  The largest holster I have is the ambidextrous milsurp holster that came with my CZ 82.  My 82 rides cocked and locked in it just fine ? like it was made for it.

Quote
The para is actually a German/Nazi round, the 9x18 just a little to big to work in those guns, but a para will work in Mak guns, albeit with a pucker factor.

The Nazis had nothing to do with designing the 9 Luger.  It was designed by Georg Luger in 1901, decades before there was such a thing as a Nazi.

During WWII, both the Axis and the Allies used the 9 Luger in combat.  In fact, both sides manufactured and carried Browning Hi-Powers.

The 9 Luger bullet has a diameter of 0.355 in; that of the 9 Makarov is 0.365 in.  Thus, the 9 Makarov cannot be chambered in a 9 Luger pistol.

Good luck loading the magazine of a 9 Makarov pistol with 9 Luger rounds ? they won't fit, because they are too long.  If one were to go out of one's way to drop a 9 Luger cartridge into a 9 Makarov chamber to fire it, one would be fortunate to learn that the 0.355-in bullet won't expand to engage the 0.365-in barrel, because if it did, the 50% greater pressure of the 9 Luger exerted on the blowback architecture of the 9 Makarov pistol may well cause a ka-Glock.





« Last Edit: November 30, 2013, 11:01:05 AM by Skookum »
Skookum
Browning Challenger III, .22 Long Rifle, Glossy Blue
CZ 83, 9 Browning Court, Satin Nickel
CZ 75 Compact, 9 Luger, Dual Tone
CZ 82, 9 Makarov, Czechoslovak Peoples' Army Black
CZ 83, 7.65 Browning, Glossy Blue
Beretta 3032 Tomcat, .32 Auto, Inox

Offline Birds Away

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2013, 07:26:50 AM »
No doubt related. The CZ was improved, because it had DA, avoiding both the stupid condition 3 and the unsafe condition 1.  CZ's are as beautiful as the BHP, and more useful too.

I should not have said troops, should have said cops. Guaranteed they were not authorized to carry cocked and locked. You can tell that by examining their half a cow size holsters.

The para is actually a German/Nazi round, the 9x18 just a little to big to work in those guns, but a para will work in Mak guns, albeit with a pucker factor.

The Browning Hi Power is an exceptionally successful design.  IMO one of the finest handgun designs ever produced and still relevant over 70 years after it was introduced.  To say the CZ 75 is more useful is very subjective.  Considering that the three most copied handgun designs in the world, 1911, BHP and CZ 75 were all designed to be carried cocked and locked, how can you say that condition one is unsafe?  I can't remember ever hearing about an ND with one of those designs.  I'm sure it happens but nowhere near as often as on the plastic fantastics.  Any gun is unsafe in untrained hands.   

Offline Skookum

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2013, 10:18:47 AM »
Read your CZ 75 Instruction Manual ? I believe it says, in so many words, to carry and store in Condition 3.

SAFETY INSTRUCTIONS
Always follow the safety instructions for your safety and the safety of others.
?
5. Always keep and carry your pistol empty, with the hammer forward except when you intend to shoot.
? INSTRUCTION MANUAL: CZ 75

*****

One might interpret that as a directive to keep and carry in Condition 4.
Skookum
Browning Challenger III, .22 Long Rifle, Glossy Blue
CZ 83, 9 Browning Court, Satin Nickel
CZ 75 Compact, 9 Luger, Dual Tone
CZ 82, 9 Makarov, Czechoslovak Peoples' Army Black
CZ 83, 7.65 Browning, Glossy Blue
Beretta 3032 Tomcat, .32 Auto, Inox

Offline Birds Away

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #22 on: December 01, 2013, 10:54:17 AM »
To me, that's just lawyer-speak.  Means absolutely nothing.

Offline Skookum

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #23 on: December 01, 2013, 12:31:58 PM »
I, too, regard it as cover-your-butt lingo.  But, it can be used to vilify Condition 2 carry to those who vilify Condition 1.
Skookum
Browning Challenger III, .22 Long Rifle, Glossy Blue
CZ 83, 9 Browning Court, Satin Nickel
CZ 75 Compact, 9 Luger, Dual Tone
CZ 82, 9 Makarov, Czechoslovak Peoples' Army Black
CZ 83, 7.65 Browning, Glossy Blue
Beretta 3032 Tomcat, .32 Auto, Inox

Offline Birds Away

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #24 on: December 01, 2013, 04:15:19 PM »
 ;D Weak minds.  If they're that scared of their guns they should leave them at home...or give them to us.

Offline mitchg233

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #25 on: December 01, 2013, 11:52:31 PM »
Quote
5. Always keep and carry your pistol empty, with the hammer forward except when you intend to shoot.

I have a few manuals, pre 2000 and after (none pre B), none of them say that. Screenshot?

Offline Skookum

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #26 on: December 02, 2013, 09:10:54 AM »
I have a few manuals, pre 2000 and after (none pre B), none of them say that. Screenshot?

I can't take a screenshot, but Safety Instruction #5 I copied from p. 18 of the English-only pdf version of the Instruction Manual I downloaded from CZ-USA.  It is the same as the English portion of the Manual that came in the Compact I bought in 2012.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2013, 06:11:52 AM by Skookum »
Skookum
Browning Challenger III, .22 Long Rifle, Glossy Blue
CZ 83, 9 Browning Court, Satin Nickel
CZ 75 Compact, 9 Luger, Dual Tone
CZ 82, 9 Makarov, Czechoslovak Peoples' Army Black
CZ 83, 7.65 Browning, Glossy Blue
Beretta 3032 Tomcat, .32 Auto, Inox

Offline 1SOW

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #27 on: December 07, 2013, 01:31:36 AM »
I enjoy Sootch too.
As this was labelled as a "comparison".  With that in mind, they remarked on the decocker's half cock position being ready to fire like a DA revolver for concealed carry;  and the 75B having the C&L safety option..   The half cock position option in the B-model does the same, but is omitted.
True it's not a biggy,  and the review was fine.

Offline s0nspark

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #28 on: January 01, 2014, 02:49:11 PM »
Always follow the safety instructions for your safety and the safety of others.
?
5. Always keep and carry your pistol empty, with the hammer forward except when you intend to shoot.
? INSTRUCTION MANUAL: CZ 75

Why... would I want to carry an empty pistol? ;-D
"A man's character is his fate."

Offline Skookum

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Re: CZ 75 Full Size and Compact 9mm Pistol Comparison -- sootch00
« Reply #29 on: January 01, 2014, 03:07:36 PM »
Always follow the safety instructions for your safety and the safety of others.
?
5. Always keep and carry your pistol empty, with the hammer forward except when you intend to shoot.
? INSTRUCTION MANUAL: CZ 75

Why... would I want to carry an empty pistol? ;-D

CYA language, perhaps written by a Czech lawyer.

You are carrying and experience an AD.  CZ gets sued.  CZ's attorney asks if you were carrying with a round in the chamber.  When you admit you were, they point to the instruction manual and say, "We specifically told you not to do that."
Skookum
Browning Challenger III, .22 Long Rifle, Glossy Blue
CZ 83, 9 Browning Court, Satin Nickel
CZ 75 Compact, 9 Luger, Dual Tone
CZ 82, 9 Makarov, Czechoslovak Peoples' Army Black
CZ 83, 7.65 Browning, Glossy Blue
Beretta 3032 Tomcat, .32 Auto, Inox

 

anything