HB Industries P10 trigger

[oldfrank]

I believe the trigger reach is shorter with the HBI.

I shot an IDPA match with mine yesterday, I had not fired a round with the HBI trigger as I just got it a day ago. I did a good bit of dry firing against a timer in my garage the day before the match. I ended up 26/56 overall which is not bad for a Super Senior!

The P-10C shot flawlessly, love the stock,black rear with the DP FO front sight. One magazine change the release button didn't want to push and I had to shift my hand a little bit.
My accuracy was very good which I credit to the trigger. I had worn a small blister with the stock trigger and the first several hundred rounds. After the match (probably 140 rounds) my finger was not sore but I could see I had rubbed the old blister spot a little bit but not as bad as stock trigger by a long shot. I blame most of the rub on trying to get a grip and fire fast and having my finger a little low on the trigger but overall, well worth the money.
I got a black trigger as I am too old for bling!

[sumoman]

<<<I believe the trigger reach is shorter with the HBI.>>

Outstanding! Will order myself the same.

[Mjolnir]

Few more observations.  Only the trigger take-up, distance between fully forward and the "wall" is shortened.  They did an excellent job with that.  The trigger is essentially pre-pulled to the point where it's 0.5mm from touching the striker safety lever...

Break, reset, and over-travel are mechanically unchanged, but feel shorter and slightly heavier...

This does not sound like this is a "social work" or carry trigger or "Threat Management" trigger at all.

I love the idea of a more or less straight trigger but I wish to leave the pretravel as-is. Perhaps there will be one made like that??



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[earlan357]

Few more observations.  Only the trigger take-up, distance between fully forward and the "wall" is shortened.  They did an excellent job with that.  The trigger is essentially pre-pulled to the point where it's 0.5mm from touching the striker safety lever...

Break, reset, and over-travel are mechanically unchanged, but feel shorter and slightly heavier...

This does not sound like this is a "social work" or carry trigger or "Threat Management" trigger at all.

I love the idea of a more or less straight trigger but I wish to leave the pretravel as-is. Perhaps there will be one made like that??



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Unless I'm shooting, my finger is off the trigger, even if holding/waiting for compliance.  The take-up weight is so light, around 1 pound, that I wouldn't rely on it alone to prevent an accidental discharge, even in factory form.  Even 12-15 pound revolver triggers won't prevent an accidental trigger pull from a startle response.  Startle response pressure at the distial tip has been measured at up to 25lbs.

[dwhitehorne]

This does not sound like this is a "social work" or carry trigger or "Threat Management" trigger at all.

I love the idea of a more or less straight trigger but I wish to leave the pretravel as-is. Perhaps there will be one made like that??

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Only you can decide that.  I don't see a big difference in the trigger pull from the factory trigger and the HBI.  The trigger shape is just better.  I'm sure there is a measurable difference but it is not great for me.  Some aren't comfortable carrying a round in the chamber, others want a 15 pound double action pull.  If your finger is on the trigger gripping the pistol and you are truelly startled you will squeeze the trigger.  You either clench your fists or open your hands palms out when startled. 

For 27 years I've been carrying a pistol everyday at work.  Model 19, model 66, G17, P7M13, P2000 and now the P320.  All had very different triggers.  I'm not concerned carrying the P10C with the HBI trigger.  David

[bigmatt17073]

Has anyone else used a trigger gauge to do some measurements after the install? I installed mine and have been playing with various striker springs.  I swapped springs and took trigger pull measurements with my Lyman digital gauge (each time 10 pulls averaged) after each with some interesting numbers, at least to me.

My results with a ~1000 round broken in FDE P-10c with the HB Industries trigger and various striker springs:
Wolff Glock 4# striker spring: 3# 11.9oz.
HBI 3# striker spring: 4# 5.9oz.
HBI 3.5# striker spring: 5# 7oz.
Stock CZ striker spring: 5# 1oz.

The interesting thing to me is that the 3.5 HBI spring gave a higher trigger pull than the stock CZ striker. The 4# Wolff ended up giving the lightest trigger pull on paper I don't think I would have thought that. I wonder how much the length has to do with that since the 3.5 is by far the longest spring and the 4# Wolff the shortest. I will add the Wolff 4# spring has a light reset. If you keep your trigger finger back when resetting the striker then let go of the trigger; the trigger doesn't return all the way forward and the trigger safety dingus stays depressed. None of the others striker springs do that. I think I need to find a 4.5# and a 5# Glock striker springs to try as well.

I will say the HB Industries trigger is a huge improvement to me for the P-10c. The stock trigger was very irritating after a longer range session on my finger, and occasionally I was pinching my finger between the stock trigger and the trigger guard. The new trigger solves both of my gripes on the stock CZ trigger shoe.

All of this is just dry firing testing since I seem to work to much lately. I have the HBI 3# striker spring installed and plan visit the range on Thursday to test it out.

[Toby196]

Has anyone else used a trigger gauge to do some measurements after the install? I installed mine and have been playing with various striker springs.  I swapped springs and took trigger pull measurements with my Lyman digital gauge (each time 10 pulls averaged) after each with some interesting numbers, at least to me.

My results with a ~1000 round broken in FDE P-10c with the HB Industries trigger and various striker springs:
Wolff Glock 4# striker spring: 3# 11.9oz.
HBI 3# striker spring: 4# 5.9oz.
HBI 3.5# striker spring: 5# 7oz.
Stock CZ striker spring: 5# 1oz.

The interesting thing to me is that the 3.5 HBI spring gave a higher trigger pull than the stock CZ striker. The 4# Wolff ended up giving the lightest trigger pull on paper I don't think I would have thought that. I wonder how much the length has to do with that since the 3.5 is by far the longest spring and the 4# Wolff the shortest. I will add the Wolff 4# spring has a light reset. If you keep your trigger finger back when resetting the striker then let go of the trigger; the trigger doesn't return all the way forward and the trigger safety dingus stays depressed. None of the others striker springs do that. I think I need to find a 4.5# and a 5# Glock striker springs to try as well.

I will say the HB Industries trigger is a huge improvement to me for the P-10c. The stock trigger was very irritating after a longer range session on my finger, and occasionally I was pinching my finger between the stock trigger and the trigger guard. The new trigger solves both of my gripes on the stock CZ trigger shoe.

All of this is just dry firing testing since I seem to work to much lately. I have the HBI 3# striker spring installed and plan visit the range on Thursday to test it out.

Interesting findings.  I definitely wouldn't have guessed those numbers, or the order of the weight of those springs.

I'm also glad to hear you say that the HBI Trigger is an improvement concerning the "pinching" of the trigger finger, as that is one of my only complaints about the P-10C so far (each of my range sessions have ended with me having a tiny blister on my trigger finger).  If you can, keep us updated on your impressions, after you get some live-fire use of the new trigger.

[earlan357]

My results with a ~1000 round broken in FDE P-10c with the HB Industries trigger and various striker springs:
Wolff Glock 4# striker spring: 3# 11.9oz.
HBI 3# striker spring: 4# 5.9oz.
HBI 3.5# striker spring: 5# 7oz.
Stock CZ striker spring: 5# 1oz.

So I went ahead and measured the trigger pull of the HBI Theta with a variety of springs.  I took the measurements from the bottom of the trigger at the hook.  This was the only way to get any consistency, so the readings are about 1 pound lower than where my finger actually rests.  Readings are an average of 10 pulls, ignoring readings with over +- 4oz of discrepancy.  Also, I have shot over 3,000 rounds since polishing the trigger bar and disconnector contact points.

            CZ OEM: 4lbs 7.8oz
          HBI 3.0#: 3lbs 9.8oz
          HBI 3.5#: 4lbs 5.2oz

      Glock OEM: 4lbs 3.6oz
Wolff Glock 5#: 4lbs 0.9oz

[s0nspark]

Few more observations.  Only the trigger take-up, distance between fully forward and the "wall" is shortened.  They did an excellent job with that.  The trigger is essentially pre-pulled to the point where it's 0.5mm from touching the striker safety lever...

Break, reset, and over-travel are mechanically unchanged, but feel shorter and slightly heavier...

This does not sound like this is a "social work" or carry trigger or "Threat Management" trigger at all.

I love the idea of a more or less straight trigger but I wish to leave the pretravel as-is. Perhaps there will be one made like that??



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Unless I'm shooting, my finger is off the trigger, even if holding/waiting for compliance.  The take-up weight is so light, around 1 pound, that I wouldn't rely on it alone to prevent an accidental discharge, even in factory form.  Even 12-15 pound revolver triggers won't prevent an accidental trigger pull from a startle response.  Startle response pressure at the distial tip has been measured at up to 25lbs.

When considering a trigger's "safety" for carry, I would say it is length of pretravel that makes the biggest difference.

As you mentioned, when amped up you can pull through a heavier trigger without feeling it as you normally do but overall movement is easier to track under stress.

[earlan357]

When considering a trigger's "safety" for carry, I would say it is length of pretravel that makes the biggest difference.

As you mentioned, when amped up you can pull through a heavier trigger without feeling it as you normally do but overall movement is easier to track under stress.

Just to be clear, are you referring to "pre-travel" as the distance required to disengage the trigger safety lever or "dingus"?  If so, that distance is the same.  When I said .5mm, I was referring to the distance before the lug on the trigger bar starts to touch the internal striker block lever.  To clarify, neither the pre-travel or trigger safety itself is .5mm.  Distance from the trigger at rest to the "wall" is reduced to about 4mm. Stock is about 10mm.

Below is a GIF showing the difference in take-up for FDE P-10C Stock trigger vs Black P-10C HBI Theta trigger, from rest to the "wall".  Keep in mind that the stock triggers between both guns we're not identical, but this is a pretty good representation. 

[s0nspark]

When considering a trigger's "safety" for carry, I would say it is length of pretravel that makes the biggest difference.

As you mentioned, when amped up you can pull through a heavier trigger without feeling it as you normally do but overall movement is easier to track under stress.

Just to be clear, are you referring to "pre-travel" as the distance required to disengage the trigger safety lever or "dingus"?

No. I mean overall length of travel from the trigger at rest to break the shot. Take up + pretravel is probably better terminology.

[oldfrank]

Good post earlan 357, your finding are very close to mine.

Pretravel or take up reduced and with the 3.5 HBI spring and light polishing + about 600 rounds, my trigger is breaking right at 45# or a hair over. I have a mechanical gauge so not as accurate.

[Stuart]

Nice post earlan 357
that  is great to see that...

[HBi]

So many ways to approach rating spring weights for striker pistols with an inner trigger pivot safety. Here is an informal one take video showing how we did it for the P10's, please let us know what you think. This forum really is loaded with experience, knowledge, and users capable of providing some of the best feedback that we have ever received. If the voice of customer here says that we need to change how we rate our P10 striker springs, we will absolutely listen. Quick video on our methodology:

https://youtu.be/U70NvpPqy8w

[copemech]

I know tins is a NON issue, but somewhere in this equation one gets into the striker springs ability to light off them little things called primers!

My Glock Nut buddy told me that one should not go below 4 pounds on the striker spring without using special primers for reliability.