Story of two steel guide rods.

[Chicago Dude]

OK guys, here is the story of my steel guide rods.
I hate original plastic rods, so I make sure on every gun I try to install steel guide rods.
I did that to my 75B, and I did that on my PCR.
When I got PCR, I went to CZ Custom and that's where I purchased my rod.
Last night I got me P-01 (99041) and few days prior I ordered some parts from CGW, and among them Steel guide rod for (PCR and P-01 - that's how they sell them).
So today I installed that guide rod to P-01, and I noticed that rod is sticking out a little. Opened the gun, checked if all is good and that rod is positioned in it's place, close it, and it's still sticking out. Very little, but noticeable.
Here is the picture of pcr and P-01 side by side (with pcr on the left side) both have rods inside :



Here is another angle how much new rod sticks out of P-01 :



Here is another angle of PCR where rod is not sticking out and laying flush :



So I opened both guns, swapped the rods and sure enough, rod from CGW was now sticking out of PCR.

Here are the rods side by side. Upper one is from CZ Custom and the bottom one is from CGW. Not only that CGW is longer, but it's also little thinner (which I would imagine means nothing).



Now I have to go and order another one from CZ Custom, because I would like this rod to be flush with the gun and not to stick out.
It's probably not a big deal if it sticks out a little, but I just don't like the look.

[M1A4ME]

Age?  I have an older CZ 75 Compact that has a wound wire recoil spring in it.  My newer ones have flat springs in them.  Maybe the different rod diameters are due to difference spring type inside diameters?

Never hurts to question things.  You might not get the right answer - or you might and you have to figure out which one of the 3 or 4 answers you get is the right one.

I would imagine the guide rod with the bevelled end would be easier to get into the hole in the front of the slide when you're assembling the slide after a field strip/cleaning.

[Chicago Dude]

Both guns are 2017.

[Mick-S]

Couple of minutes on a grinder then sandpaper to clean it up and it would be flush. 

[Chicago Dude]

Couple of minutes on a grinder then sandpaper to clean it up and it would be flush. 

Let's see. Two options for me :

a. Buy the grinder, buy sandpaper, do some work.
b. Buy new guide rod from CZ Custom that I know is exact size.

  I think choice (for me) is clear. 
You see, I am probably one of the very few gun owners that doesn't have a grinder. 

[del4c]

The oem plastic one sticks out slightly-

[ZanderMan]

I read recently on this forum where a member stated that CZ told him NOT to use steel guide rods in the compacts. Didn?t allow the frame to move in  a straight line, but rather put an upward force on it. If you look at your guide rod with the slide pulled back, it does tip down. If the movement is not straight line (even if at an angle) and more of a curve, this would cause wear on the hole in the front of the slide.

I?ll see if I can find the reference.

[M1A4ME]

I didn't mean age of the pistol.  I meant that maybe over the years, as the type of spring changed, so did the factory recoil spring guide diameter.

At some point, when an aftermarket company decided to make guide rods the examples they used might be different due to the age/time when their example they used for their guide rods was made.

That old Compact has that wound wire recoil spring (not saying it's original, I bought it used).

The Pre B CZ 85 I have (also used) had a pretty standard looking single wire recoil spring.

I don't know if any of the newer guns have flat wire springs (Compacts and FS metal frame CZ's) but the P07/P09 pistols do.

[twowheels]

I read recently on this forum where a member stated that CZ told him NOT to use steel guide rods in the compacts. Didn?t allow the frame to move in  a straight line, but rather put an upward force on it. If you look at your guide rod with the slide pulled back, it does tip down. If the movement is not straight line (even if at an angle) and more of a curve, this would cause wear on the hole in the front of the slide.

I?ll see if I can find the reference.

I have a steel compact tuned by CZC and they put a steel guide rod in it. 

[Chicago Dude]

I am far cry from being gun expert, but here is what my common sense tells me :
If I buy steel gun, I should have steel rod in it.
Heck, the only plastic gun that I have (I hate plastic on guns) has also steel rod in it.

[Scarlett Pistol]

I am far cry from being gun expert, but here is what my common sense tells me :
If I buy steel gun, I should have steel rod in it.
Heck, the only plastic gun that I have (I hate plastic on guns) has also steel rod in it.

You're common sense is right. Steel guide rod in steel gun is fine. BUT*** you must use another piece of common sense. Be sure to use the appropriate weight recoil spring. If you go too light for your loads then the steel guide rode will transfer too much energy into the little lips on the frame where it seats. This can cause those to wear.

For the alloy frame you should run an alloy guide rode. Those plastic guide rods are cheap but they are well engineered and purposeful. A benefit they add is the plastic absorbs some recoil, sort of like a cushion. So you won't have to worry about wearing those lips where the guide rod seats. If you want the great look of a metal guide rod in your PCR I'd recommend ordering an alloy guide rod from CZ Custom. Then throw the flush fit one in your steel frame PCR.

Trust me, I'm not just repeating hear say. Can you get away with it? Sure, but you're going to have to be extra cautious and observant of recoil spring weight, load power, and how far your brass ejects. To me it's not worth it the extra concern and risk compared to getting an alloy (aluminum) guide rod.

[Chicago Dude]

I am far cry from being gun expert, but here is what my common sense tells me :
If I buy steel gun, I should have steel rod in it.
Heck, the only plastic gun that I have (I hate plastic on guns) has also steel rod in it.

You're common sense is right. Steel guide rod in steel gun is fine. BUT*** you must use another piece of common sense. Be sure to use the appropriate weight recoil spring. If you go too light for your loads then the steel guide rode will transfer too much energy into the little lips on the frame where it seats. This can cause those to wear.

For the alloy frame you should run an alloy guide rode. Those plastic guide rods are cheap but they are well engineered and purposeful. A benefit they add is the plastic absorbs some recoil, sort of like a cushion. So you won't have to worry about wearing those lips where the guide rod seats. If you want the great look of a metal guide rod in your PCR I'd recommend ordering an alloy guide rod from CZ Custom. Then throw the flush fit one in your steel frame PCR.

Trust me, I'm not just repeating hear say. Can you get away with it? Sure, but you're going to have to be extra cautious and observant of recoil spring weight, load power, and how far your brass ejects. To me it's not worth it the extra concern and risk compared to getting an alloy (aluminum) guide rod.

Thanks SP.
I went on CZ Custom site and didn't find aluminum guide rod for compact gun.
Also, what spring weights do you recommend for my pcr and 99041 ?
I don't reload, and I shoot only good quality ammo. Either 124 gr or 147. Mostly Federal. No +p or anything weird.

[Scarlett Pistol]

Well the aluminum ones that used to be available were on the CZ USA web store. But they aren't even listed anymore.

The lighter recoil springs for the Compacts are 14 lbs. If you don't shoot NATO spec or +P and run your steel guide rod with those then just check the guide rod and frame when you do a quick cleaning. I have run warmer loads and ended up just running the stock recoil springs. They're heavier but they break in after 200 or 300 rounds and aren't terrible. Cajun Gun Works has a page where they explain how far brass should go. I'll go find it.

Again, I've peened my steel frame with ammo that was hotter than I thought, lighter recoil springs, and the steel guide rod. It was ever so slightly there, but it started happening. That would only be amplified on the alloy frames. You have a beautiful set of pistols and I just don't want that to happen when you're not realizing it could happen.

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

[doc171]

Hold on a minute, I just looked on the CZ website and the aluminum compact guide rod is shown on page 11 of the spare parts for compacts heading. It's in stock and price is $18.00. It is 1:35 AM on Saturday morning.

[SI VIS PACEM PARRABELLUM]

Couple of minutes on a grinder then sandpaper to clean it up and it would be flush. 

Let's see. Two options for me :

a. Buy the grinder, buy sandpaper, do some work.
b. Buy new guide rod from CZ Custom that I know is exact size.

  I think choice (for me) is clear. 
You see, I am probably one of the very few gun owners that doesn't have a grinder. 

Don't you have a file? Sandpaper. A little time and a steady hand and a steady hand and you could easily make that longer rod sit flush.
They are simply just 2 different designs from 2 different companies. The CGW rod is exactly like the style that Steve Bedair sold before his death. I have had that style in my PCR for many thousands of rnds and it sticks out just a tad and doesn't bother me at all.