The Original CZ Forum
CZ LONG ARMS => VZ-58 semi auto rifle => Topic started by: wormraper on June 02, 2020, 03:25:03 PM
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Just got a VZ 58 in 7.62x39 for the first time (only played with my buddy's VZ2008 back in the day) and am on the search for mags. I've hear that the aluminum mags are the best to get, but to try and search for NOS mags as the aluminum mags had issues with feedlips and cracks (they were kind of disposable like the early M16 mags). And I've heard that the new CSA polycarbonate mags are good, but I can't find them ANYWHERE.
any good locations for NOS mags and/or the new CSA ones for a decent price? The gun only comes with 2 mags from Atlantic and I'm a mag whore so I intend to get at least 30 mags for the gun
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The poly mags are good reliable range mags but they dont hold up to drops very well, I've got some beat up aluminum mags and they are still going strong. If given the choice I will buy good or used condition aluminum mags ove NIB plastic ones for the 58. Keep an eye out they pop up over on the files every now and again.
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Check Numrich, they just had a Memorial Day Sale with NOS mags on sale.
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The poly mags are good reliable range mags but they dont hold up to drops very well, I've got some beat up aluminum mags and they are still going strong. If given the choice I will buy good or used condition aluminum mags ove NIB plastic ones for the 58. Keep an eye out they pop up over on the files every now and again.
yeah, I was watching Rob's videos and saw that. just trying to figure out WHERE to find them, cuz I can't find them ANYWHERE
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Check Numrich, they just had a Memorial Day Sale with NOS mags on sale.
yeah, I actually came across that by googling about half an hour ago. $19.95 for NOS... my only problem is that Numrich isn't open for business thanks to that f-tard Cuomo (yay for being in New York Numrich), and I was hoping to have them for next week when I get my gun in lol.
so $19.95 is a good price for VZ58 NOS mags though? I'm a newbie to the VZ 58 so have no idea what prices are good or not
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Check Numrich, they just had a Memorial Day Sale with NOS mags on sale.
yeah, I actually came across that by googling about half an hour ago. $19.95 for NOS... my only problem is that Numrich isn't open for business thanks to that f-tard Cuomo (yay for being in New York Numrich), and I was hoping to have them for next week when I get my gun in lol.
so $19.95 is a good price for VZ58 NOS mags though? I'm a newbie to the VZ 58 so have no idea what prices are good or not
$20 is a very good price for unissued vz58 mags. Unfortunately, Big Fredo has Wuhan foo-ed Numrich for the time being. A quick search reveals that some place called DK Firearms has nos mags on sale for $25 each, which ain’t bad. Most places sell them for $30 - $40 each.
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All my mags I bought in used/good/very good for </= $15 each. 20-25 I would consider decent for NOS unissued
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All of the used aluminum mags I’ve purchased have been off of Gunbroker from a seller named “Jestice Arms”. Good prices and fast shipping, and zero issues out of any of them.
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VZ58 mags WERE NOT made to be disposable like the early AR15 mags. Aluminum is at least 2-3x the thickness/gauge of AR mags.
So long as they don't have dents that impede follower and realize you might have to replace mag springs (and you clean them before you use them like any surplus mag), surplus mags are generally GTG regardless op physical wear.
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Was just going by what Ive been told on the files and akforum.net. They just warned me to stack up on good mags because they have a tendency of cracking along the spine, feedlips and locking lug area regularly and should be considered disposable and that you'll be dumping quite a few that get damaged
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Mags are always a consumable item, but I have mags that are pretty rough shape that have been loaded for several years now and only 1 that Ive seen has had cracked feed lip by spine, and it was that way when I got it. It still works well. Ive got another that has the tab on the bottom plat torn off where it covers the spine, works well too. I only have 1 mag that doesn't work right and it got hit hard enough to move material on the side where it inserts into the mag well and takes significant force to get it in. Occasionally it has a fail to feed issue but still useable at the range
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oh i know all mags are disposable. I was just saying that I was told that they are inherently weak and disposable. The exact wording from several of them was "VZ-58 mags are rather flimsy and weak. they crack around the locking lugs, spine and feeds lips quite often. They're not meant to be used and abused, but used a few times and then thrown away. They're designed to be disposable like the original AR-15 mags".
so as I said I was trying to get a stack of mags so I didn't have to worry about not having enough when I wore these out"
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Lol they were talking about themselves, probably thought they were on the "emotional support for soggy french fries" forum ;D
Was this over on the files?
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Was this over on the files?
yup
and if it's true that VZ58 metal mags actually ARE long lasting, I won't have to buy AS much initially (although I know I'll end up with 30 or 40... I'm a mag whore, which is why I have nearly 250 AK mags and continue to look at deals going "ooohhh, I could use some more")
(well, Numrich JUST announced this morning that they're good to go, so I picked up a 10 pack of the NOS mags)
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Looks like the smoke polymer 7.62x39 mags are back in stock at Czechpoint. Also, FAB Defense makes some polymer mags for the Vz58. Don’t know how good they are, though. Web search indicates they have some failures with vz2000s, but that doesn’t mean much.
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Looks like the smoke polymer 7.62x39 mags are back in stock at Czechpoint. Also, FAB Defense makes some polymer mags for the Vz58. Don’t know how good they are, though. Web search indicates they have some failures with vz2000s, but that doesn’t mean much.
I had heard to stay away from the FAB and Korean VZ.58 mags, but I don't know more than that
Yikes, a bit pricey on the polymer mags. was hoping more towards $15.... for that price I'll just get the military aluminum ones for $19.95
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Korean mags are steel -- but pretty much just imported into Canada AFAIK.
Sounds like AK Files are talking out of their rears -- probably a little chafed still over AKOU's praise of the weapon. Under standard use, I've not seen the issue of which they speak occur in any frequency to be concerning. And I've seen several dozen well-used mags, most of which I sold.
CitizenPete did a write-up on the Fab mags here. They're GTG except the rear locking tab is fragile under abuse as best as I can recall, but look that one up. He might have even made a vid.
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these?
didn't he give it a fail?
https://czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=80185.0
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CitizenPete did a write-up on the Fab mags here. They're GTG except the rear locking tab is fragile under abuse as best as I can recall, but look that one up. He might have even made a vid.
RSR, thanks for the heads up on that post! Lord knows when all of my old surplus mags were made, but they keep on running great. Adding to something you said in a reply in Pete’s old post, there is definitely a noticeable difference in how much shorter distance I have to rock my VZ mags in versus my AK. Took me a little while to get over worrying about that. [emoji23]
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these?
didn't he give it a fail?
https://czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=80185.0
That's the one. Scanned the vid and yes, he gave them a "fail" as a fighting mag.
He had issues w/ the polymer locking tabs shearing and not being strong enough. Otherwise, they appeared to have functioned fine, even when ran over w/ a car.
Ultimately, he compared them to TAPCO AK mags, which I use for range use and particularly like in their 20 round configuration. Unfortunately, Freedom Group's failures resulted in shuttering TAPCO this year.
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these?
didn't he give it a fail?
https://czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=80185.0
That's the one. Scanned the vid and yes, he gave them a "fail" as a fighting mag.
He had issues w/ the polymer locking tabs shearing and not being strong enough. Otherwise, they appeared to have functioned fine, even when ran over w/ a car.
Ultimately, he compared them to TAPCO AK mags, which I use for range use and particularly like in their 20 round configuration. Unfortunately, Freedom Group's failures resulted in shuttering TAPCO this year.
got it. I get ya. I have my share of tapco ak mags too. I got em for under $5 each, so I stockpiled 50 of the slabsides ones. I'll never run out lol
as for the fab defense, I winced at the price for range mags. If they were tapco prices I'd get some for bleeps and giggles ,but when Numrich has NOS mil mags for $19.95, kind of a hard pill to swallow. 10 of those on the way, as well as the 2 that come with the gun should keep me busy for a while. I'll look out for deals as time goes on to build my "stockpile" (yay, more mags for my wife to roll her eyes at when she sees the shipments come in :D )
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So on mags -- I just want to reiterate how GOOD VZ58 mags actually are.
Basically, they have the weight of AK bakelite mags as well as the strength of AK steel mags under most field use conditions (i.e., where you're not testing to failure limits).
Unlike steel, the VZ58 aluminum mags also have much less issues on the front of corrosion.
And one feature you'll see on the VZ58 OE mags is that they have a shelf at the top that interfaces with the receiver (preventing over-insertion including when under abuse) that OE AK mags and most aftermarket lack.
Main thing to keep in mind is that the Soviets wanted the entire combloc to standardize on the AK -- the VZ58 would have only have been granted an exception if it met OR EXCEEDED the AK47 across all testing parameters.
Also on FAB, I'm pretty sure they both weigh more (slightly) and cost more than surplus, as well as being less durable. I think there's a place for them in low mag capacity states -- as mentioned in CP's post, I think the base plate allows for the use of FAB's AR mag coupler (believe it's for 3 mags), but they only make the 30 round mag version AFAIK.
Offering in 10 and 20 rounds at same price point as current would be awesome. And I most definitely think it would open up a market niche and demand that's not there for their current weapon -- reduced rounds = less weight, which means the polymer configuration should be less prone to shearing under most circumstances as well...
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CitizenPete did a write-up on the Fab mags here. They're GTG except the rear locking tab is fragile under abuse as best as I can recall, but look that one up. He might have even made a vid.
RSR, thanks for the heads up on that post! Lord knows when all of my old surplus mags were made, but they keep on running great. Adding to something you said in a reply in Pete’s old post, there is definitely a noticeable difference in how much shorter distance I have to rock my VZ mags in versus my AK. Took me a little while to get over worrying about that. [emoji23]
Yes, and that's why the tactical mag releases are so much better than on an AK (running original Galil releases, etc, excluding Krebs spring-loaded option).
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got it. I get ya. I have my share of tapco ak mags too. I got em for under $5 each, so I stockpiled 50 of the slabsides ones. I'll never run out lol
as for the fab defense, I winced at the price for range mags. If they were tapco prices I'd get some for bleeps and giggles ,but when Numrich has NOS mil mags for $19.95, kind of a hard pill to swallow. 10 of those on the way, as well as the 2 that come with the gun should keep me busy for a while. I'll look out for deals as time goes on to build my "stockpile" (yay, more mags for my wife to roll her eyes at when she sees the shipments come in :D )
I agree the price isn't equivalent to the utility. That's why I don't own any. I also don't particularly care for FAB's colors. Green is a little too green, not OD, and Tan is a sand desert tan, not FDE. Granted, I do have the FAB green grip on a VZ, but there aren't what most folks are used to who regularly see Magpul/equivalent color offerings.
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got it. I get ya. I have my share of tapco ak mags too. I got em for under $5 each, so I stockpiled 50 of the slabsides ones. I'll never run out lol
as for the fab defense, I winced at the price for range mags. If they were tapco prices I'd get some for bleeps and giggles ,but when Numrich has NOS mil mags for $19.95, kind of a hard pill to swallow. 10 of those on the way, as well as the 2 that come with the gun should keep me busy for a while. I'll look out for deals as time goes on to build my "stockpile" (yay, more mags for my wife to roll her eyes at when she sees the shipments come in :D )
I agree the price isn't equivalent to the utility. That's why I don't own any. I also don't particularly care for FAB's colors. Green is a little too green, not OD, and Tan is a sand desert tan, not FDE. Granted, I do have the FAB green grip on a VZ, but there aren't what most folks are used to who regularly see Magpul/equivalent color offerings.
Fab Defense's green is way more GREEN than the ODG we're all used to that's for sure. I've had some experience with their AK stuff so I've seen it up close. the green is way more like a brighter version of foliage rather than ODG
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Fab Defense's green is way more GREEN than the ODG we're all used to that's for sure. I've had some experience with their AK stuff so I've seen it up close. the green is way more like a brighter version of foliage rather than ODG
I think I'd put it at roughly forest or camo green in the old woodland bdus (on a fresh print), whereas the OD green is more of a blend of the brown and green in that pattern plus a shade or two darker.
Pick one green forever, I'd go w/ Ranger Green, which is more of a brown-green with a dash of gray or foliage.
And actually, I used to be a foliage-hater, but now that the US Army has ditched the UCP pattern, I've actually softened on the color itself and wish it was more available. Prefer a Wolf Gray to it in most instances, but Foliage is a heck of a lot better than Magpul's blue-gray Sniper Gray that's out of place anywhere that's not a police cruiser...
FAB's tan isn't as light as the Magpul sand -- but it's probably just a shade or two darker, meaning still quite bright.
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I bought 2 Fab mags when they had a sale and also the Fab AFG. The mags sure look cool at the range, if nothing else. Also can practice reloads without unnecessarily scratching up the beautiful finish [emoji846]
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200605/78c6cac0c194a344305ecc09ba181136.jpg)
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Been tempted to try a Fab Def mag myself but not many places have em and I never seem to be able to ‘bundle’ one with an order. I’ve bought a lot of other Fab Def gear and always been happy. But the factory aluminum mags are solid, heavy & durable. $20 for a NOS or like new mag is a fair price these days.
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holy bleep. I got mine in today from Atlantic. Rob wasn't lying. This thing is one of the best assembled combloc rifles I've ever seen. It has the smoothest action I've ever felt, and the trigger isn't bad. It's also the lightest bleep rifle I've ever held either, especially having gotten used to AK's and AR's for many years. It honestly just FEELS like quality when looking over the build. No machine and tooling marks. Siken smooth operation, and did I say light? The ONLY thing I can bitch about is that the pistol grip was made for Asians or something. It's just tiny in my bear paws. are there 2nd party grips that I can use that would be bigger? It's not a big deal, but I have large hands and it dwarfs the grip more than the AK popsicle stick
easily one of the best drunk purchases I ever made (ordered it last sunday, got it today). I also have a 10 pack of NOS military Czech mags too to supplement the two polymer mags it came with. I may actually grab another one if they come back in stock in the next 6 months.
(oh, small thing. I got the open front sight instead of the closed front sight like Rob did)
(https://i.imgur.com/eQ0KVF0l.jpg)
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For 922r -- only option other than Czechpoint is Ronin grips AFAIK. I installed a hogue grip sleeve on my ronin (galil option) -- they're (ronin) a bit slippery.
He can do colors too as custom orders.
https://shop.roninsgrips.com/Czech-vz58-Long-Grip-Black-with-Screw-Czech-vz58-Long.htm
https://shop.roninsgrips.com/Czech-vz58-Israeli-Galil-Ultra-Style-Black-with-Screw-Czech-vz58-Israeli.htm
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Wormraper, now ya need an extended bolt release, and maybe even a left hand charging handle! [emoji6]
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200611/e09986b35270bf688c149c6a765a49cc.jpg)
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lol, I'm a lefty, so the charging handle is just perfect.
extended bolt release might be handy, as it's solely on the left side and my instinct is to hit it with my RIGHT hand thumb
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lol, I'm a lefty, so the charging handle is just perfect.
extended bolt release might be handy, as it's solely on the left side and my instinct is to hit it with my RIGHT hand thumb
Good deal!
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lol, I'm a lefty, so the charging handle is just perfect.
extended bolt release might be handy, as it's solely on the left side and my instinct is to hit it with my RIGHT hand thumb
Vz58 usa or whatever that new site is sells ambi mag releases that are fairly ideal for lefties. You can leave on or cut off the right side extension. Not aware of any issues with those releases (speaking to factory that makes them, not the US company).
As a lefty with the charging handle on support hand side, there's little need for a bolt release. The ones that vz58 usa sells -- I've had some from the same factory that had major issues w/ about 1/2 failing after the first couple range sessions. Issues with posts/rods breaking (at bolt carrier when trying to arrest, inside channel, etc) as well as rods coming unattached from finger extension portion (it was a puddle weld that connected them at the time, ~5 or 6 years ago). Could have been a bad batch. Could just be the product -- had roughly a dozen so decent sample size and might not have heard of all the problems.
You have to either hand fit from different vendors or run the bolt release and mag release from the same vendor. If cutting off right side mag release extension, then there's no reason a Zendl bolt release wouldn't work with the vz58 usa mag release.
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Is $20 for an aluminum Czech mag too pricey?
The retail seller on Gunbroker (in Fuquay Varina) sold me one of his "Buy Now" and it has functioned perfectly, as have the polymer mags which were included "new in box" with the Czechpoint rifle.
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Is $20 for an aluminum Czech mag too pricey?
The retail seller on Gunbroker (in Fuquay Varina) sold me one of his "Buy Now" and it has functioned perfectly, as have the polymer mags which were included "new in box" with the Czechpoint rifle.
$20 and under fair price w/ $15 and under cheap. $25 and over expensive. All prices for new or like new mags. Used mags drop $3-5 per level.
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The retail seller on Gunbroker (in Fuquay Varina) sold me one of his "Buy Now" and it has functioned perfectly, as have the polymer mags which were included "new in box" with the Czechpoint rifle.
So were those the clear polymer mags?
The surplus aluminum mags are great, and they’ve been $20 for a while. Occasionally Numrich ran em on sale for $15 but they were shut down for a while and didn’t re-open til the 8th with a small staff.
I’d still like to try a new production mag just cause surplus is surplus and as stock shrinks, prices rise. The Koreans (KCI?) don’t have a great rep and I don’t think they’re imported in the US. The Fab Defense windowed polymer mags look good so I ordered one for $23 with shipping from Zahal (12% off & free shipping w/ code WIN12).
Seems like every time I think about poly VZ mags and look at CSA’s site, they’re out of stock.
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Got mine a few months ago it’s real nice
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Look at VZ58USA. They seem to have all mag sizes and shapes in stock.
https://www.vz58usa.com/
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Look at VZ58USA. They seem to have all mag sizes and shapes in stock.
https://www.vz58usa.com/
Wow. They're awfully bleeped proud of their merchandise...not sure how their rifles merit a @ $2,000.00 price tag when CSA's are $1,200 or so at the most.
Who builds their rifles / receivers?
If they could wrangle up an ambidextrous safety, I might be interested, as long as it didn't cost my left nut.
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Look at VZ58USA. They seem to have all mag sizes and shapes in stock.
https://www.vz58usa.com/
Wow. They're awfully bleeped proud of their merchandise...not sure how their rifles merit a @ $2,000.00 price tag when CSA's are $1,200 or so at the most.
Who builds their rifles / receivers?
If they could wrangle up an ambidextrous safety, I might be interested, as long as it didn't cost my left nut.
lol, their accessories too. $250 for a left side charging handled carrier? lol
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Nah, they didn’t raise their prices any LOL! Got my second left-hand charging handle from them back in early January for $173 shipped. [emoji15]
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Ya that’s seems really high but I gotta say Vaclav from VZ USA is a good guy, and I have done a few deals with him that worked out well for me. He also auctions stuff on Gunbroker, many times starting at .01
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Look at VZ58USA. They seem to have all mag sizes and shapes in stock.
https://www.vz58usa.com/
Wow. They're awfully bleeped proud of their merchandise...not sure how their rifles merit a @ $2,000.00 price tag when CSA's are $1,200 or so at the most.
Who builds their rifles / receivers?
If they could wrangle up an ambidextrous safety, I might be interested, as long as it didn't cost my left nut.
I might have a rear to fire safety or two in my collection that I'd be willing to part with -- forward to fire just requires filing a slot on the 180* inverse and for the detent on the other side. Probably $75-100 ballpark pricewise. These were never cheap.
Per mods' request added the same to my classifieds listing here: https://czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=110643.msg859489#msg859489
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Nah, they didn’t raise their prices any LOL! Got my second left-hand charging handle from them back in early January for $173 shipped. [emoji15]
NBD. Just a 45% markup in price... :o
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Look at VZ58USA. They seem to have all mag sizes and shapes in stock.
https://www.vz58usa.com/
The $60 for a rattle canned yellow plus a free sticker off of bananas "banana mag" is a hoot! Did anyone serious buy that at 3x what it's worth!?
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I winced at $45 NOS mil-supr mags when Numrich has THOUSANDS in stock for $19.95
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Look at VZ58USA. They seem to have all mag sizes and shapes in stock.
https://www.vz58usa.com/
Wow. They're awfully bleeped proud of their merchandise...not sure how their rifles merit a @ $2,000.00 price tag when CSA's are $1,200 or so at the most.
Who builds their rifles / receivers?
If they could wrangle up an ambidextrous safety, I might be interested, as long as it didn't cost my left nut.
I might have a rear to fire safety or two in my collection that I'd be willing to part with -- forward to fire just requires filing a slot on the 180* inverse and for the detent on the other side. Probably $75-100 ballpark pricewise. These were never cheap.
Per mods' request added the same to my classifieds listing here: https://czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=110643.msg859489#msg859489
Interesting...do you have to do any mods to a CSA Vz58 to get the ambi safety to work?
"Rear to fire only without your modifications AT YOUR OWN RISK!" sounds concerning. What all has to be done?
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Interesting...do you have to do any mods to a CSA Vz58 to get the ambi safety to work?
"Rear to fire only without your modifications AT YOUR OWN RISK!" sounds concerning. What all has to be done?
AFAIK: File or dremel in a detent slot at 180* for the disconnector to rise/engage. File or dremel in a detent slot at 180* for the trigger spring safety arm to engage inline w/ the disconnector slot.
The only forward to fire ambi safety I'm aware of is a VERY rare NEA or whatever the other Canadian vz58 accessory company is that NEA purchased.
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Interesting...do you have to do any mods to a CSA Vz58 to get the ambi safety to work?
"Rear to fire only without your modifications AT YOUR OWN RISK!" sounds concerning. What all has to be done?
AFAIK: File or dremel in a detent slot at 180* for the disconnector to rise/engage. File or dremel in a detent slot at 180* for the trigger spring safety arm to engage inline w/ the disconnector slot.
The only forward to fire ambi safety I'm aware of is a VERY rare NEA or whatever the other Canadian vz58 accessory company is that NEA purchased.
I have no idea why the Vz58 was designed with such a kludgy ass backwards safety lever, especially for the majority right handers. That's one of the few things I dislike about these rifles. Instead of an easy thumb operation, I'm guessing they thought they had to make switching the safety from safe to fire a two handed operation in case gun-ignorant conscripts were prone to negligent discharges during such operation.
There is a screw-together ambi safety made in the Czech Republic, but apparently it will not work with CSA rifles:
http://www.vz58rifle.com/products/ambidextrous-safety-cz858-/
I'm wondering if CSA uses a proprietary semi-auto safety lever for their rifles?
It would seem the some enterprising soul could weld a flat tab on the left end of a semi-auto safety and pin a lever to it to make a useable forward-pushing safety for right handers (like the ambidextrous safety levers on the Bren 2).
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I have no idea why the Vz58 was designed with such a kludgy ass backwards safety lever, especially for the majority right handers. That's one of the few things I dislike about these rifles. Instead of an easy thumb operation, I'm guessing they thought they had to make switching the safety from safe to fire a two handed operation in case gun-ignorant conscripts were prone to negligent discharges during such operation.
There is a screw-together ambi safety made in the Czech Republic, but apparently it will not work with CSA rifles:
http://www.vz58rifle.com/products/ambidextrous-safety-cz858-/
I'm wondering if CSA uses a proprietary semi-auto safety lever for their rifles?
It would seem the some enterprising soul could weld a flat tab on the left end of a semi-auto safety and pin a lever to it to make a useable forward-pushing safety for right handers (like the ambidextrous safety levers on the Bren 2).
No, the left side of the vz58 is smooth to avoid snagging on kit as well as when crawling on the ground and rendering the weapon unsafe -- charging handle and safety on the same side for the same reason.
And whatever your gripe w/ vz58, it's still a heck of a lot better than an AK's safety... And at roughly the same time as the vz58 was developed, US weapons still had safeties w/in the trigger guard -- point being vz58 was far ahead of it's time and contemporary competitors.
And yes, that's the safety I was referencing.
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I have no idea why the Vz58 was designed with such a kludgy ass backwards safety lever, especially for the majority right handers. That's one of the few things I dislike about these rifles. Instead of an easy thumb operation, I'm guessing they thought they had to make switching the safety from safe to fire a two handed operation in case gun-ignorant conscripts were prone to negligent discharges during such operation.
There is a screw-together ambi safety made in the Czech Republic, but apparently it will not work with CSA rifles:
http://www.vz58rifle.com/products/ambidextrous-safety-cz858-/
I'm wondering if CSA uses a proprietary semi-auto safety lever for their rifles?
It would seem the some enterprising soul could weld a flat tab on the left end of a semi-auto safety and pin a lever to it to make a useable forward-pushing safety for right handers (like the ambidextrous safety levers on the Bren 2).
No, the left side of the vz58 is smooth to avoid snagging on kit as well as when crawling on the ground and rendering the weapon unsafe -- charging handle and safety on the same side for the same reason.
And whatever your gripe w/ vz58, it's still a heck of a lot better than an AK's safety... And at roughly the same time as the vz58 was developed, US weapons still had safeties w/in the trigger guard -- point being vz58 was far ahead of it's time and contemporary competitors.
And yes, that's the safety I was referencing.
That was going on 60+ years ago - back when side mounted magazines were still a thing, too. Now things have evolved with ambidextrous safeties, body armor, CQB etc. The AR evolved to ambidextrous controls, same as most modern military rifles. The Vz58 should do the same, otherwise be relegated to the antiquated forever, For most shooters today, an ambi safety would improve their shooting.
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That was going on 60+ years ago - back when side mounted magazines were still a thing, too. Now things have evolved with ambidextrous safeties, body armor, etc. The AR evolved to ambidextrous controls, same as most modern military rifles. The Vz58 should do the same, otherwise be relegated to the antiquated forever, For most shooters today, an ambi safety would improve their shooting.
My point is to look at its contemporaries. It's still way ahead of that curve, and the fact that we're able to upgrade most parts to modern sensibilities/expectations is a testament to it's enduring and advanced designed.
I believe comparing it to guns designed 50-60 years after it and using features they have that this weapon doesn't have to criticize it is an unfair comparison.
I agree with you on the value of an ambi safety -- however, Czechpoint/CSA is fully invested in the side rail mounts and running those with an ambi safety is a nonstarter for EVERY design I've seen. I suspect that's the "why."
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I have no idea why the Vz58 was designed with such a kludgy ass backwards safety lever, especially for the majority right handers. That's one of the few things I dislike about these rifles. Instead of an easy thumb operation, I'm guessing they thought they had to make switching the safety from safe to fire a two handed operation in case gun-ignorant conscripts were prone to negligent discharges during such operation.
There is a screw-together ambi safety made in the Czech Republic, but apparently it will not work with CSA rifles:
http://www.vz58rifle.com/products/ambidextrous-safety-cz858-/
I'm wondering if CSA uses a proprietary semi-auto safety lever for their rifles?
It would seem the some enterprising soul could weld a flat tab on the left end of a semi-auto safety and pin a lever to it to make a useable forward-pushing safety for right handers (like the ambidextrous safety levers on the Bren 2).
No, the left side of the vz58 is smooth to avoid snagging on kit as well as when crawling on the ground and rendering the weapon unsafe -- charging handle and safety on the same side for the same reason.
And whatever your gripe w/ vz58, it's still a heck of a lot better than an AK's safety... And at roughly the same time as the vz58 was developed, US weapons still had safeties w/in the trigger guard -- point being vz58 was far ahead of it's time and contemporary competitors.
And yes, that's the safety I was referencing.
That was going on 60+ years ago - back when side mounted magazines were still a thing, too. Now things have evolved with ambidextrous safeties, body armor, CQB etc. The AR evolved to ambidextrous controls, same as most modern military rifles. The Vz58 should do the same, otherwise be relegated to the antiquated forever, For most shooters today, an ambi safety would improve their shooting.
Let’s not kids ourselves here, it’s far from being antiquated even today. The AKM is still in heavy use today worldwide, and it was designed to be so cheap and fast to manufacture that it could just be left on the battlefield right alongside a dead commie. The VZ-58 was/is clearly a few steps ahead of the AKM. If you need to have all the modern amenities, well then the VZ-58 would not be the rifle for you. It’s becoming more of a collectable niche rifle for those of us with the means to buy better more modern rifles, yet also a desire for tasteful representations of past military prowess
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That was going on 60+ years ago - back when side mounted magazines were still a thing, too. Now things have evolved with ambidextrous safeties, body armor, etc. The AR evolved to ambidextrous controls, same as most modern military rifles. The Vz58 should do the same, otherwise be relegated to the antiquated forever, For most shooters today, an ambi safety would improve their shooting.
My point is to look at its contemporaries. It's still way ahead of that curve, and the fact that we're able to upgrade most parts to modern sensibilities/expectations is a testament to it's enduring and advanced designed.
I believe comparing it to guns designed 50-60 years after it and using features they have that this weapon doesn't have to criticize it is an unfair comparison.
I agree with you on the value of an ambi safety -- however, Czechpoint/CSA is fully invested in the side rail mounts and running those with an ambi safety is a nonstarter for EVERY design I've seen. I suspect that's the "why."
The CSA side rail is pretty stout and the safety pin sits pretty low in relation to it, so the rail could be relieved fairly easily to accommodate a left side safety lever without effecting the integrity of the side rail itself.
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I have no idea why the Vz58 was designed with such a kludgy ass backwards safety lever, especially for the majority right handers. That's one of the few things I dislike about these rifles. Instead of an easy thumb operation, I'm guessing they thought they had to make switching the safety from safe to fire a two handed operation in case gun-ignorant conscripts were prone to negligent discharges during such operation.
There is a screw-together ambi safety made in the Czech Republic, but apparently it will not work with CSA rifles:
http://www.vz58rifle.com/products/ambidextrous-safety-cz858-/
I'm wondering if CSA uses a proprietary semi-auto safety lever for their rifles?
It would seem the some enterprising soul could weld a flat tab on the left end of a semi-auto safety and pin a lever to it to make a useable forward-pushing safety for right handers (like the ambidextrous safety levers on the Bren 2).
No, the left side of the vz58 is smooth to avoid snagging on kit as well as when crawling on the ground and rendering the weapon unsafe -- charging handle and safety on the same side for the same reason.
And whatever your gripe w/ vz58, it's still a heck of a lot better than an AK's safety... And at roughly the same time as the vz58 was developed, US weapons still had safeties w/in the trigger guard -- point being vz58 was far ahead of it's time and contemporary competitors.
And yes, that's the safety I was referencing.
That was going on 60+ years ago - back when side mounted magazines were still a thing, too. Now things have evolved with ambidextrous safeties, body armor, CQB etc. The AR evolved to ambidextrous controls, same as most modern military rifles. The Vz58 should do the same, otherwise be relegated to the antiquated forever, For most shooters today, an ambi safety would improve their shooting.
Let’s not kids ourselves here, it’s far from being antiquated even today. The AKM is still in heavy use today worldwide, and it was designed to be so cheap and fast to manufacture that it could just be left on the battlefield right alongside a dead commie. The VZ-58 was/is clearly a few steps ahead of the AKM. If you need to have all the modern amenities, well then the VZ-58 would not be the rifle for you. It’s becoming more of a collectable niche rifle for those of us with the means to buy better more modern rifles, yet also a desire for tasteful representations of past military prowess
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To each is own, I suppose. I'm not one of those "nyet, rifle is fine" traditionalists. Nearly all my guns are shtf ready, so I upgrade as much as practicable: rails, optics, furniture, fire control, adjustable gas systems, etc. to enable me to hit targets more accurately and efficiently. Though the AK has a kludgy safety, for sure, that's not easily remedied, it has a good trigger (generally) and the ability to upgrade to compete with the latest thing today.
The only complaints I have with the Vz58 are with the safety, the squishy trigger and the iron sights are too low for me. No gun is perfect, but I do what I can to improve them to my own needs.
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I have no idea why the Vz58 was designed with such a kludgy ass backwards safety lever, especially for the majority right handers. That's one of the few things I dislike about these rifles. Instead of an easy thumb operation, I'm guessing they thought they had to make switching the safety from safe to fire a two handed operation in case gun-ignorant conscripts were prone to negligent discharges during such operation.
There is a screw-together ambi safety made in the Czech Republic, but apparently it will not work with CSA rifles:
http://www.vz58rifle.com/products/ambidextrous-safety-cz858-/
I'm wondering if CSA uses a proprietary semi-auto safety lever for their rifles?
It would seem the some enterprising soul could weld a flat tab on the left end of a semi-auto safety and pin a lever to it to make a useable forward-pushing safety for right handers (like the ambidextrous safety levers on the Bren 2).
No, the left side of the vz58 is smooth to avoid snagging on kit as well as when crawling on the ground and rendering the weapon unsafe -- charging handle and safety on the same side for the same reason.
And whatever your gripe w/ vz58, it's still a heck of a lot better than an AK's safety... And at roughly the same time as the vz58 was developed, US weapons still had safeties w/in the trigger guard -- point being vz58 was far ahead of it's time and contemporary competitors.
And yes, that's the safety I was referencing.
That was going on 60+ years ago - back when side mounted magazines were still a thing, too. Now things have evolved with ambidextrous safeties, body armor, CQB etc. The AR evolved to ambidextrous controls, same as most modern military rifles. The Vz58 should do the same, otherwise be relegated to the antiquated forever, For most shooters today, an ambi safety would improve their shooting.
Let’s not kids ourselves here, it’s far from being antiquated even today. The AKM is still in heavy use today worldwide, and it was designed to be so cheap and fast to manufacture that it could just be left on the battlefield right alongside a dead commie. The VZ-58 was/is clearly a few steps ahead of the AKM. If you need to have all the modern amenities, well then the VZ-58 would not be the rifle for you. It’s becoming more of a collectable niche rifle for those of us with the means to buy better more modern rifles, yet also a desire for tasteful representations of past military prowess
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To each is own, I suppose. I'm not one of those "nyet, rifle is fine" traditionalists. Nearly all my guns are shtf ready, so I upgrade as much as practicable: rails, optics, furniture, fire control, adjustable gas systems, etc. to enable me to hit targets more accurately and efficiently. Though the AK has a kludgy safety, for sure, that's not easily remedied, it has a good trigger (generally) and the ability to upgrade to compete with the latest thing today.
The only complaints I have with the Vz58 are with the safety, the squishy trigger and the iron sights are too low for me. No gun is perfect, but I do what I can to improve them to my own needs.
The trigger is squishy, that’s a good way to describe it. Would certainly like a better trigger pull and shorter reset for added shooting pleasure
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