Round nose vs. Truncated Cone Bullets

[bobjd]

Wobbly, Thank you I will keep you posted.  Bob

[CzechnoWizard]

I second or 3rd or 25th....everything said regarding the superiority of flat points for their ease of loading, longer bearing surface, and terminal effects on steel. I've also preached the need for dramatically different OAL when using FP vs RN in a cz. 124gr FP is where it's at for steel!

But....I've managed to very successfully load many thousands of various FP bullets, including the XTP, and various plated HP, along with all variety of RN using my lowly Lee 4 die (carbide) sets. I crimp separately in a FCD, so the 3rd die is used solely for seating and works perfectly, literally. Never had a single instance of trouble. I guess you would classify it as a hollow stem type. What really surprises me is that I am able to remove the stem at any time simply by turning the depth knob all the way out and then dumping the seater stem out the top of the die. As I recall, Lee even includes an instruction stating that they will customize a stem if needed for unique bullets for something like $3. Did I buy the last good set of dies Lee ever made? I'm constantly confused by how so many feel the need for expensive rcbs,dillion,Redding, etc just to even get powder and bullets back into a case, nevermind accuracy concerns.  How am I so lucky?

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[LeeM]

Thanks for the info. Being new to the forum I really appreciate you being willing to share what you know. I have learned a lot. I am using a Dillon 650 with Lee dies. Loading 9MM 125 gr. RN Blue Bullets and have some 125 TC Blues on the way.

I also use a Dillon XL650 with Lee and Lyman Dies

I will be using the same weight bullet and same powder charge as I am using with the RN so it will be interesting to see the results.

Just note that Flat Pointed Bullets do seat deeper into the case and pressure will be higher.  You might want to start low and work up again.

I recently changed from Acme 135 RN  to Blue 135 TC. My push test increased the max OAL from 1.145” to 1.172”, while keeping nearly identical seating depth of 0.243”. The coated Acme bullets are .001” bigger in diameter, which may be hitting the free bore, I can’t be sure. . Now I can load Win 231 powder to 1.150” OAL using published data, rather than testing loads on a ladder.

[Wobbly]

The coated Acme bullets are .001” bigger in diameter, which may be hitting the free bore...

• Well, as explained in the Max OAL instructions you may need to sand off several thou of diameter to be sure.

Now I can load Win 231 powder to 1.150” OAL using published data, rather than testing loads on a ladder.

• That statement doesn't make sense. "load W231 to 1.150 OAL"... You mean use an OAL of 1.150 ?? You'd hardly want to do that. You'll get much better results with deeper seating.

"...rather that testing loads on a ladder..." You always want to test your cartridges with incremental loadings (aka 'ladder loads') because that's how you tune your cartridge to the pistol, and get the most out of it.


• You've found the physical limits on OAL, but if 1.150" is the recipe length then you need a new recipe. There is lots of load data out there for W231 and/or HP-38 with OALs less than 1.100" and you want to find them. This because you want to seat that bullet around 1.130" for best performance.

Don't trust me on this. Load some at 1.150" and some at 1.130" and shoot 2 different targets from a rest or sand bag. You'll see. It's a fairly dramatic difference.

 

[LeeM]

Thanks Wobbly! I did mean 1.172. I sanded the coating finish down on the Acmes and it had a small effect in my SP-01. I’ll try the 1.130” length with a ladder load work up too. Plenty of time to reload now - no matches for at least another week.

[tde44]

FWIW - I went to the Blues TC from their RN when I bought a CZ75. It allowed me to run a longer COAL than I could otherwise. Without the TC the rounds had to be seated more deeply than I liked so that I could use the same 9mm ammo in all of my 9's.

Since then I switched to ACME's RN. Their profile shape has worked well for me without going too short. Side benefit is that no more smurf fingers and my bullet collator doesn't have t be cleaned as often from blue dust buildup.

Accuracy was good (enough for me at least which is only to 25yrds) with either profile in the Blues or the ACME. I do run bunny fart loads (arthritis).

[Wobbly]

• You've found the physical limits on OAL, but if 1.150" is the recipe length then you need a new recipe. There is lots of load data out there for W231 and/or HP-38 with OALs less than 1.100" and you want to find them. This because you want to seat that bullet around 1.130" for best performance.

Did you check this thread out ?? ...

https://czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=96152.msg739645#msg739645

 

[bobjd]

I did get my Dillon 9MM dies and installed them. After initial set up I loaded 20 rounds of Blue Bullets 125gr TC and  went to the range. No issue with my Shadow2 or Glock19.4. Plunk testing on the Shadow2 indicated a 1.300" OAL. I used the S2 for the plunk test as that has the tightest tolerances and at this time I am not loading gun specific reloads. I did my shooting at 7 yds. freehand and was pleased with the results. I will load some more to verify and than do some adjusting on powder and using a rest to see if I can improve the results.

Wobbly thanks for all your info and thanks to everyone else for the same.

[Wobbly]

Please forgive the off-topic bunny trail

Wobbly, thanks for the info on the seating die. Until a year ago I was loading on a Lee Classic Turret press which I think did a good job. I came across a basket case Dillon 650 that had been sitting in a guys garage for about 8 years. It was set up for 45 ACP and had powder and primers in it as well as rust and dries grease in the pins. I disassembled it, cleaned, removed rust, lubed and reassembled.

Bob -
The 650 is a great machine. Mine has given me a lot of pleasure. There are several inexpensive accessories that are so good, they are almost "must haves" for this machine. You might put these on the birthday list...
• UFO LED lighting kit by KMS Squared  (Amazon)
• Spent Primer Chute by UniqueTek  (http://uniquetek.com/product/T1346-650)
• Primer Switch by seller Snowshooze  (only on Ebay HERE)
(This guy makes the VERY best 650/750 accessories. Always check him first, especially for bearings.)
• Specialty Seating Anvils individually made for your precise bullet by yours truly.



Hope this helps.

[bobjd]

Please forgive the off-topic bunny trail

Wobbly, thanks for the info on the seating die. Until a year ago I was loading on a Lee Classic Turret press which I think did a good job. I came across a basket case Dillon 650 that had been sitting in a guys garage for about 8 years. It was set up for 45 ACP and had powder and primers in it as well as rust and dries grease in the pins. I disassembled it, cleaned, removed rust, lubed and reassembled.

Bob -
The 650 is a great machine. Mine has given me a lot of pleasure. There are several inexpensive accessories that are so good, they are almost "must haves" for this machine. You might put these on the birthday list...
• UFO LED lighting kit by KMS Squared  (Amazon)
• Spent Primer Chute by UniqueTek  (http://uniquetek.com/product/T1346-650)
• Primer Switch by seller Snowshooze  (only on Ebay HERE)
(This guy makes the VERY best 650/750 accessories. Always check him first, especially for bearings.)
• Specialty Seating Anvils individually made for your precise bullet by yours truly.



Hope this helps.

Thanks for the accessory info. I have the light and it is a must have. I will keep the anvils in mind.