Bayou Bullet 9mm 120gr FP problem

[Sage6wt]

Greetings All,
I recently tried some 120gn 9mm FP Bayou bullets but they will not plunk test in my CZ Shadow 2 or G17 even if OAL is under 1.0". 
I must be making an error in the process somehow. I never ran into this with  jacketed, plated or cast bullets for 9 or 45.   I know 1.0" is too short even for a CZ chamber so please let me know your thoughts.
Thank you.

https://bayoubullets.net/9mm-120-gr-tc/

[SoCal]

Have you checked the bullet diameter?  Have you tried dropping a bullet into the (cleaned) chamber and measuring the depth to the top of the hood?  Bullet overall + measured depth will give you a VERY repeat VERYrough idea of cartridge OAL.

There have been a couple of bullets my CZ's just didn't like.

[Sage6wt]

Thank you.  I measured everything I could think of an maybe need to start over with new brass.  I forgot the gentleman’s name at Bayou but he recommended this bullet when I mentioned I use titegroup. He was great and I have been waiting to hear back from him.  Some people on this site are so knowledgeable that I reread their reply’s 3 times.  I figured being new to powder coated bullets that I missed something.

[SI VIS PACEM PARRABELLUM]

You need to do the push test on any gun you plan to use any given bullet in and it needs to be done anytime you are trying a different bullet. Using new brass will get you nowhere and only add to your confusion when you get the same result.
In the stickies here on the reloading forum read the directory section on reloading for CZ and DW pistols. Everything you need to know you will find there and help you get on track.

[SoCal]

So what is the bullet diameter?

[Sage6wt]

Bayou brand / 9MM 120 GR. TC,  .356

I did read a lot because it is a new problem.  I did not just bug everyone without researching first so I figured someone here had and figured out the coated bullet problem already. 

Thank you.

[Fuzzy Sights]

I also use Bayou bullets.  If loading for my CZs I always specify .355.  Not sure why but I almost always have problems with .356 diameter bullets.  They run fine in SIGs and Browning High Power, but will jam in 3 of my CZs.

Best wishes.

JW

[DMY]

Bayou Bullets work well in my .38s a nd .45s. However, I could not get 135 gr RN to feed in my SP-01, even seating at 1.08" and passing my plunk test. The nose profile was simply too long.

[Wobbly]

I recently tried some 120gn 9mm FP Bayou bullets but they will not plunk test in my CZ Shadow 2 or G17 even if OAL is under 1.0". 
I must be making an error in the process somehow. I never ran into this with  jacketed, plated or cast bullets for 9 or 45.   I know 1.0” is too short even for a CZ chamber so please let me know your thoughts. Thank you.

Welcome Aboard !

Some starting questions...
• You didn't say, but I take it you followed the instructions in the Stickies.

• The tapered chamber can get you into trouble very quickly. Therefore this part is significant.... Did you use a piece of brass that had been fired in your pistol ? And it was still in the fired condition when you started this test ?

• Did you flare (bell) the case mouth to get the bullet to go in ?

• And this is the bullet you want to load...


Those are shaped a lot like PD 124gr JHP so they will be shorter, but not a problem.

• The 0.356" dimeter is really the traditional size for 38Super, but since all Berry Mfg plated bullets are that diameter, it shouldn't be a big deal.


Answer those questions straight down the row, please.

[tdogg]

So are the actual bullets sized to 0.356 inch?  Just want to eliminate that as an issue.

The other method to determine the maximum OAL for bullet/gun is to take a dummy (sized and ready to load) case and flare as you normally would to seat a bullet.  Seat a bullet and then remove the flare (crimp) lightly so it doesn't interfere with the chamber before headspacing on the case mouth.  Then visually inspect that it will drop into the chamber (similar to the "Plunk Test").  If not seat it deeper a couple of thousandths (0.005) and test in the chamber again.  Repeat this until you get where the bullet will "plunk" into the chamber and turn with little resistance.  That is your maximum OAL for that bullet in that chamber.

If you attempt this alternate method and still end up with a super short maximum OAL, then I'd mark up a bullet and case with a sharpie (get the ogive and entire sides of case) and see where it is getting rubbed off when performing the plunk test and spin (with a "normal" length OAL e.g. 1.100 inch or something).  There could be a bullet diameter issue, you could be seating them crooked, you could be shaving off the coating and gumming up the chamber, etc...  If you have a Lee FCD you could follow the above procedure after swaging it down in the FCD and see if the length maximum OAL increases.  That would point to a bullet seating/diameter issue in your process.

Cheers,
Toby

[wv109323]

What dies are you using?
I am having a similar problem. I was having an occasional FTF, a case that would not "plunk" test, poor accuracy and occasionally a round that would not extract.
 My THEORY ( as I have not proven it yet) is the seating die.
My dies are Dillon 9mm. The seating die is much larger than the outside of the case while the case is in the seating die.( probably .005 to .007" ) My THEORY is that some bullets are not being seated straight and the bullet run out is causing my problems. The brass case is actually being "bent" and will not plunk test along with the other problems.
 The Dillon dies have a RN and a SWC seating stem or bullet seater. I was using the RN stem and was having some problems. I switched to the SWC stem thinking it would seat against the flat portion of my 120 g. TC boolits. About 50% would not plunk test.
 I was thinking like you and thought it was an OAL problem with the bullet hitting the rifling but it may be the case interfering in the chamber.
This is something to look at. I actually tested a .38 Special seating die and all test loads have passed the plunk test.

[Sage6wt]

Greetings,
I am using Lee dies.   I have been swamped and have had little time to investigate my issues but I did purchase a Lee factory crimp die that I hope to try this weekend.
I will update soon.
Thank you.

[Wobbly]

I am using Lee dies.   I have been swamped and have had little time to investigate my issues but I did purchase a Lee factory crimp die that I hope to try this weekend.

1. IMHO, dies are not your problem. Adjustment of the dies may be.

2. The Lee FCD is a complex item and often adds to the issues rather than solving anything. It may serve a purpose in straight-walled cartridges like 38Spcl, but the 9x19 Luger cartridge isn't straight-walled, so exactly what is it supposed to do ? I would encourage you NOT to install it until you get your standard die set working. If you cannot get standard dies to work, then what is adding an additional layer of complexity going to do ?

3. If you want to work toward a solution, then please answer the questions in Post #8.

 

[Wobbly]

I am having a similar problem. I was having an occasional FTF, a case that would not "plunk" test, poor accuracy and occasionally a round that would not extract.

My THEORY ( as I have not proven it yet) is the seating die. My dies are Dillon 9mm. The seating die is much larger than the outside of the case while the case is in the seating die.( probably .005 to .007" ) My THEORY is that some bullets are not being seated straight and the bullet run out is causing my problems. The brass case is actually being "bent" and will not plunk test along with the other problems.

The Dillon dies have a RN and a SWC seating stem or bullet seater. I was using the RN stem and was having some problems. I switched to the SWC stem thinking it would seat against the flat portion of my 120 g. TC boolits. About 50% would not plunk test.

I was thinking like you and thought it was an OAL problem with the bullet hitting the rifling but it may be the case interfering in the chamber.

This is something to look at. I actually tested a .38 Special seating die and all test loads have passed the plunk test.

It really helps to have a Seating Die anvil that centers the bullet before allowing seating to occur. You may need to modify your existing anvil OR make a new one precisely for the bullet you are using. Dillon makes very nice dies, but they really fall down on fitting & centering the bullet. FMJ / RN are sloppy at best, and conical bullets like the OP's or Hornady XTP's don't have a solution at all.

But unlike the OP's Lee dies, at least Dillon gives you the option to change out the anvil. Here's a photo of some anvils I've made to fit Hornady XTP and Precision Delta JHP...

[tdogg]

Yeah, sorry if I mislead you but you most likely don't want to use a Lee FCD.  Most folks, if they have lee equipment, have one already.  I was just stating that if you did already have one, that you could seat a bullet long, swage it down (crimp it) using the FCD then perform the iterative approach of finding your maximum OAL by seating it deeper and deeper until it passes the Plunk test.  If you bullet was out of round or seated crooked, the FCD would take care of that (not in a good way) and you at least could get to the real maximum OAL for that bullet in your chamber.

Cheers,
Toby