Czechpoint VZ 58

[RSR]

To clarify -- the Dtechnik and earlier Czechpoint guns w/ 15" barrels may have only needed 5 when they had the barrel extension installed since it's not technically a muzzle device -- not 100% certain how BATF classifies.  Once you put on a muzzle device, then 6 are needed.

For the new Czechpoint guns with 16" threaded barrels and the VZ2008s, 6 US parts are definitely needed.

[RSR]

The striker -- i.e. linear hammer -- is frequently forgotten from VZ58 922r lists.  It does the same thing and would probably be counted by the ATF.  I guess it could be argued in court as to whether or not a striker is indeed a hammer, but it would be a costly argument.  That is, of course, if a 922r violation would ever go court.  As far as I know, there have been no such cases.

Have a lawyer friend search westlaw or lexus nexus.  There are hundreds if not thousands of 922r prosecutions.  Generally not standalone charges but charges nonetheless.  There are also numerous constructive possession cases as well, which effectively are the same thing area of the law IMO.  Recently there was a case (Ohio maybe) where a guy built a pistol AR with a stock capable buffer tube (not illegal) and was pulled over by LE on his way back from the range.  Allegedly the cops switched the stock from his rifle to his pistol (both ARs and both in car) and charged him with a SBR violation.  Regardless of the truth of the facts with that case, that cops will look for anything they can to justify searches retroactively (including serving warrants at the wrong address) is a long standing tradition, sometimes unfortunately involving "creating" or "manufacturing" evidence.  922r is one of those things that you should absolutely do to cover your six, just like using a buffer tube on AR pistols that won't accept a stock...

And let's not pretend that the powers that be in this country are becoming more gun friendly...  Any lever available to be pulled to confiscate and restrict will likely be used, or attempt to be used, by the gun banners in the coming years.

[slimjim]

To clarify -- the Dtechnik and earlier Czechpoint guns w/ 15" barrels may have only needed 5 when they had the barrel extension installed since it's not technically a muzzle device -- not 100% certain how BATF classifies.  Once you put on a muzzle device, then 6 are needed.

For the new Czechpoint guns with 16" threaded barrels and the VZ2008s, 6 US parts are definitely needed.

Wrong again!
THIS IS NOT ABOUT WHO IS RIGHT OR WRONG, BUT ABOUT THE LAW!


 All past present and future CSA imported rifles only need 5 parts even the guns which use the 16" barrel (which they used for yrs. by now) but these 5 parts will vary as to what they are depending on Model, all USA build guns Century etc.. must use 6 parts!

Here is a partial list of what some companies use (some are now defunct)!

The following is a list of what U.S. manufactured(non imported) parts are used on the U.S. market avaialbe vz58 variants.

For compliance D-Technik Rifles use
1 trigger
2 disconnector
3 sear
4 floorplate
5 follower

Century vz2008 rifles use
1 receiver
2 barrel
3 muzzle device
4 disconnector
5 sear
6 gas piston


Ohio Ordnance works rifles use
1 Receiver
2 Sear
3 disconnector
4 Gas piston
5 Muzzle extension
6 Floorplate

Ohio Rapid Fire factory rifles use
1 Receiver
2 Trigger
3 Sear
4 Disconnector
5 Gas piston
6 Muzzle extension


On some of the new CSA models the parts may be grip, handguards and stock USA made (3) and the other 2 USA parts are in mag!

So please correct Ur info since it is 100% wrong!

Thanks

[RSR]

Slimjim, you have your facts wrong.  There are 16 total 922r parts on any VZ58 with a muzzle device, and per the law a maximum of 10 of those parts can be foreign made.  Basic arithmetic then concludes the requirement of 6 US made parts.

You can go w/ 5, but then you are in violation of the law (again, with perhaps the exception of Dtech and early Czechpoint VZ58s with permanently welded barrel extensions).  Again, here are the 16 total 922r parts present on (most) VZ58s and variants.

Sixteen parts, need 6 US parts.

1 Receiver
2 Barrel
3 Muzzle attachment
4 Bolt
5 Bolt carrier
6 Gas piston
7 Trigger
8 Hammer
9 Sear
10 Disconnector
11 Buttstock
12 Pistol grip
13 Forearm, handguard
14 Magazine body
15 Follower
16 Floorplate

[slimjim]

CSA use only 5 parts on their guns even the new ones, if they needed 6 surely the BATF would have shut them down and they also list on the CSA rifles only 5 parts are required!

However CSA has gotten cheap and due to lack of original parts on their Cal. versions they include 7 US 922 parts but list only 5 are needed!

Also on some of their other VZ 58s they do use 6 US parts but say only 5 are needed!

[RSR]

I wouldn't let Czechpoint's website confuse you too much, though it is confusing...  While they say 5 on this particularly listing, they also say 7 and list seven parts...  If we stick with 7 and 1 extra, then we're at six (7-1=6), an d 6 is also mentioned in regards to steel trigger.  My guess is that the parts list is correct, even if the rest of the listing is templated and wrong...

https://www.czechpoint-usa.com/vz-58-tactical-762-?l=1

The vz.58 Sporter was imported into the United States in compliance with 18 U.S.C. 925(d)(3). CzechPoint adds USA made parts to the vz. 58 Sporter so as to legally reconfigure the firearm with a separate pistol grip and stock. This means that all vz. 58 rifles capable of using double stack magazines possess 5 USA made parts to fully comply with Title 18, U.S.C., Section 922(r).  The vz. 58 rifle is not sold with the bayonet lug as importation of the vz. 58 with a bayonet lug would violate US import law.
This rifle model includes seven USA made parts (only five US made parts are required for 922r compliance so this rifle model possesses one extra US made part).   The seven USA made parts are: trigger (glass-filled nylon), handguard, grip, polymer follower, polymer floor plate, buttstock, and removable muzzle brake.  If the Czech steel trigger is preferred, please scroll down to the bottom of the page to purchase the steel trigger installed and it will be installed before your rifle ships.  If the Czech steel trigger is installed, the rifle still meets 922r compliance with the remaining six USA made parts.

[Howlin Mad]

Don't know of any either but there always is a 1st! Strange part is Czechpoint lists that all VZ58's which can take doublestack mags need 5 US parts however they also put 5 US parts in their single stack guns which is a contradiction to what they said!

I have always heard the reason the VZ needs only 5 not 6 US parts is due to their milled receivers.

I am waiting to see when someone will be charged for shouldering a Sig Brace on a pistol! Been worried about using mine and the law changed a week after I got it!

A receiver is a receiver.  Milled, stamped, folded, polymer, doesn't matter, only country of origin matters.

[slimjim]

Above post is 100% wrong! As I said before a imported milled VZ/AK needs 5 parts for 922 but 6 parts for a Stamped Receiver rifle!

From the Govt website, read bottom paragraph and U see 5 Parts only needed!

922 (r)
 The Imported Parts Law (1990)
 178.39 otherwise known as 922(r) 10 Foreign parts law on semi auto Rifles & Shotguns
http://www.atf.treas.gov/regulations/27cfr178.html
 Sec. 178.39 Assembly of semiautomatic rifles or shotguns.
 (a) No person shall assemble a semiautomatic rifle or any shotgun using more than 10 of the imported parts listed in paragraph (c) of this section if the assembled firearm is prohibited from importation under section 925(d)(3) as not being particularly suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes.
 (b) The provisions of this section shall not apply to:
 (1) The assembly of such rifle or shotgun for sale or distribution
 by a licensed manufacturer to the United States or any department or agency thereof or to any State or any department, agency, or political subdivision thereof; or
 (2) The assembly of such rifle or shotgun for the purposes of
 testing or experimentation authorized by the Director under the
 provisions of Sec. 178.151; or
 (3) The repair of any rifle or shotgun which had been imported into or assembled in the United States prior to November 30, 1990, or the replacement of any part of such firearm.
(c) For purposes of this section, the term imported parts are:

 (1) Frames, receivers, receiver castings, forgings or stampings
 (2) Barrels
 (3) Barrel extensions
 (4) Mounting blocks (trunnion)
 (5) Muzzle attachments
 (6) Bolts
 (7) Bolt carriers
 ( Operating rods
 (9) Gas pistons
 (10) Trigger housings
 (11) Triggers
 (12) Hammers
 (13) Sears
 (14) Disconnectors
 (15) Buttstock
 (16) Pistol grips
 (17) Forearms, hand guards
 (18) Magazine bodies
 (19) Followers
 (20) Floor plates
The 16 countable parts of an AK rifle. No more than 10 of these parts may be imported.
 On a typical stamped receiver rifle you need to replace 5 parts with no muzzle attachment and 6 parts with a muzzle attachment.
 On a typical milled receiver rifle you need to replace 4 parts with no muzzle attachment and 5 parts with a muzzle attachment, because there isn't a barrel trunnion, it is part of the receiver.

[RSR]

Slimjim -- the VZ58 is not an AK.

The AK does not have a sear since integral in the trigger...  So sear and trigger for AK only count as one part for 922r.  Hence the 15 parts for AK vs 16 for VZ58, if looking at both having a milled receiver (again, entirely separate weapon designs, just shared caliber).  Stamped receivers have a trunnion too, so an add'l 922r part. 

That said, a receiver is a receiver and country of origin does matter for 922r regardless of stamped or milled.  If you want to discuss the trunnion, then that's a separate part from the receiver...

Be careful with taking everything you find on the internet as gospel.  Repeating bad information doesn't make it correct.

[MeatAxe]

Here's a chart that shows the Vz58 has the potential to have 16 foreign parts applicable to 922r. Barrel extensions, trigger housings, operating rods and trunions are not applicable on a Vz:

http://922r.com

So you'd have to come up with as many as 6 replacement US made parts to make it 922r compliant and still use stock Czech military magazines:

Those US-made, non-magazine parts available are:

1. Pistol Grip
2. Butt stock
3. Handguard/forend
4. Muzzle device
5. Gas Piston
6. Trigger
7. Disconnector
8. Sear
9. Barrel
10. Receiver

Many of these parts are made / Sold by CNC Warrior and/or Bonesteel.

[Brasky]

This reminds me of that guy who was banned for asking about headspace twice a day.

Last I checked 922r was based on how many foreign made parts not how many US made parts. 922r is going to vary from VZ to AK as they are completely different firearms. Even two imported stamped AKs may need different amounts of US made parts to reduce the foreign made part count depending on features of the rifle

[slimjim]

As I said before if a imp. VZ/AK and it has  a milled receiver  it needs 5 US parts!

[RSR]

As I said before if a imp. VZ/AK and it has  a milled receiver  it needs 5 US parts!

There are no less than a dozen posts by a half dozen folks here trying to illustrate to you as respectfully as possible that you are passing along incorrect information that could get others into legal trouble.  Please stop.

Be careful with taking everything you find on the internet as gospel.  Repeating bad information doesn't make it correct.

[slimjim]

Here is what I posted on the Largest Gunforum today!


On another forum I did run across a thread about 922 and I think much info on there is wrong? I always heard that a imported CSA VZ 58 rifle since it has a milled receiver needs only 5 US compl. parts but the VZ 2008 does need 6 for 922, which is how they do come and CSA does list that with their guns.

 Also heard a imp. SLR 95 due to a milled receiver only needs 5 us 922 parts? So what is the actual reason? Is it due to a milled receiver instead of stamped?
 On the other forum nobody seems to agree with what I always heard about Imp milled receiver guns!

 Thank You!


Below is the answer from 1 of their "Resident Experts"!



You are correct. Milled receivers don't have a separate front trunnion, so the stamped need one extra part. Applies to milled AKs, VZ's, and Galils!



The above is what I have known all along but here nobody seems to know that!

[Brasky]

So you're vz58 kid on gunboards? That makes sense as vz58 kid rips on every vz2008 post on gunboards about how their newly acquired weapon is guaranteed to have the gremlin and be junk.

I see you left out the next posters response:

"You really can't mix AK's and VZ's since they are completely different weapon platforms, in the end you have to get the countable foreign parts count to 10 or below. One thing to remember is you have to either know what the BATF counts as a part (sometimes what they consider a part is not what logic might consider the part to be) so if there's no clear cut answer manufacturers might decide to err on the side of caution in some cases (and could explain why some count 5 while others count 6). On AK's the list is well documented, I'm not so sure it's the same with the VZ's."

He has 36,000 posts compared to your posters 1,400. He clearly states it is about having 10 or fewer foreign made parts on the BATF list. Milled receiver guns TEND to need less US made parts but not always. Example: milled rifle with muzzle device versus stamped rifle with non-threaded muzzle

I'm still trying to figure out though what milled vs stamped has to do with VZs as both the vz58 and vz2008 have milled receivers. That kind of defeats your argument on why the vz2008 needs one more part since it's not a stamped receiver